When Will Tuning Your Car Void Your Warranty? - Podcast

"SteveLehto" (stevelehto) 07/28/2016 at 09:30 • Filed to: None

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One of the most common things I get asked is: “Will ‘tuning’ my car void its warranty?” The answer is, “Probably not,” but you still need to be careful about it. As always, know what you are doing before you do it.

I’ve podcasted before on the topic of the Magnuson Moss Warranty Act (the “Federal Lemon Law”) and have mentioned that manufacturers cannot require you to use their parts or service to maintain warranty coverage.

But there are certain circumstances where they can deny warranty coverage for claims resulting from modifications made to the vehicle. If your modded out, stanced, NOS-breathing ride blows its manifold, all bets might be off.

Here is the audio:

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And the video:

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Urambo Tauro > SteveLehto 07/28/2016 at 09:41

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Ford even gives their technicians a heads-up on what to look out for when servicing a vehicle that’s under warranty:

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SteveLehto > Urambo Tauro 07/28/2016 at 09:47

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Wouldn’t surprise me. But I’ve also seen them do things like claim a K&N air filter caused a camshaft to go bad and so on.

Urambo Tauro > SteveLehto 07/28/2016 at 09:57

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A filter? Heh, it would be awesome to hear Mona Lisa Vito tear that theory apart in court.

SteveLehto > Urambo Tauro 07/28/2016 at 10:08

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Too many people simply think “Aftermarket” = “Voided Warranty.”

And some of them work at dealers.

450X_FTW > SteveLehto 07/28/2016 at 10:39

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I’d tell them to show me in the FMEA where my mod could cause a warranty issue, but that’s just because I’m an engineer and require proof.

On a sidenote, I’ve read that with lifting jeeps being so common the rule was always if the lift is over 3" then it can void your powertrain warranty due to such major changes in drift shaft to axle angles.

SteveLehto > 450X_FTW 07/28/2016 at 10:42

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There clearly are mods that can cause things to break. It’s just a question of when they have gone too far. And, sometimes, they just like to point to the mods as an easy out when they are stumped for a fix.

450X_FTW > SteveLehto 07/28/2016 at 10:49

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I recall a story where a guy had a lifted Wrangler that had a crankshaft failure, and the dealer argued that due to the lift and oversize tires, this created additional load on the engine causing premature crankshaft failure.....

NJAnon > SteveLehto 07/28/2016 at 11:30

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Im no path of least resistance guy but yeah, I’ve told people that once they enter the tuning realm they’ll either have to work on any repairs themselves, have a personal mechanic or be best friends with the tuning place they got the mods from.

Especially hearing Lehto say that you can be right and still lose? yeah I’m not getting my blood pressure up for that.

Snuze: Needs another Swede > SteveLehto 07/28/2016 at 12:19

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Great explanation of when mods will/will not void your warranty. Especially the bit about taking the mods off before you go in for service - I know a guy who put a monster turbo and several other mods on his new car, hung a rod through the side of the block, reverted it back to stock, and got the engine replaced under warranty.

jimz > NJAnon 07/28/2016 at 12:56

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the thing is, people talk about it as though “void your warranty” is a unilateral thing. The manufacturer can deny a particular warranty claim if a modification or aftermarket part caused the failure. e.g. if you use a “Bob’s filters” air filter, and it comes apart causing your engine to score its cylinder walls, they’re going to say “sorry, it’s on you.” it’s not a defect, you did something which caused the damage.

that still doesn’t unilaterally void all warranty coverage. If you’ve got twin turbos and nitrous on your Mustang and your radio fails, they can’t use the engine mods as justification to deny warranty replacement on the radio.

NJAnon > jimz 07/28/2016 at 14:27

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Where I live, I feel there are more examples of service places using the “you’ve made mods so you must race” as a get out of jail free card so they don’t have to put up with the hassle. So they can be selective on which cars they service. You mileage may vary wherever other oppo live.

Standard_Deviation > SteveLehto 07/29/2016 at 00:04

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Vaguely related question:

A few years ago, I bought my wife a Honda Civic Si. I quite like it, and wonder how it would handle on a track. (I have an S2000 for track duty, but who doesn’t want to know how their other cars would handle it?)

So I ring up Honda Canada and ask them straight up “If I participate in a closed circuit advanced driver training program with my Si, will I void my warranty?” (Don’t worry, I didn’t give them my name or VIN, and I called from a publicly accessible phone...) Their answer was “It depends what happened to the car.” So I clarify that I’m not talking about accidents, where the car collided with something, but a failure of some sort while or after attending a track day. Also clarified that it’s not “racing” because no timing equipment is allowed, nor is competition between drivers. Again, the answer was “It depends...” By her tone, I got the impression that the customer relations agent meant “You’re fucked” when she said “It depends”.

Considering that the performance model of the car was manufactured and marketed to perform waaaaaay beyond what is legally permissible on public roads, could one not successfully argue that they expected the warranty included in the purchase to apply when the product was enjoyed responsibly on a closed circuit?

For the record, I never tracked the Si. Really, I didn’t. And I’m not just saying this because Honda reads Jalopnik...

ateamfan42 > SteveLehto 08/01/2016 at 15:00

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Some of them work at dealers and go out of their way to find excuses to try to void warranties.

A great example was the story I read when I frequented the Mazda 6 forums. A user had installed an aftermarket compressor bypass valve on his Mazdaspeed 6. For those unfamiliar with turbo systems, a bypass or blow-off valve does not control boost levels, but just prevents compressor surge when the throttle is closed. His lovely dealership service advisor saw the valve, and decided to document in the official Mazda computer system that this guy had installed an aftermarket wastegate (which can control boost level, and therefore power levels produced by the engine). So now this guy faced having any future engine warranty issues denied because a “professional” reported the presence of a part that was never even present.

RevengencerAlf > 450X_FTW 08/02/2016 at 12:36

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Now if you’d said driveshaft I might buy into it but crankshaft? Damn. Maybe I’m just a fusser but I’d say an engine and its components should be able to survive whatever resistance makes it past the transmission/drivetrain

RevengencerAlf > SteveLehto 08/02/2016 at 12:39

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Granted some actually buy into that at dealers but I think it’s more the people at the dealers know that most people will take no for an answer if a plausible reason is attached, regardless of any truth behind it. (Seriously how many times have you had to tell people “no, they’re still liable even though they put up a sign that says otherwise? I recall that coming up in different senses at least twice during your podcasts).

Dealers know if they challenge someone to call them on a contractual technicality, most people don’t have the resolve (or money) to pour over that contract and hire a lawyer if necessary to fight them.

PS: Oh wow I’m still grey at OL? My life is over!

SteveLehto > RevengencerAlf 08/02/2016 at 13:01

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I agree. And I explain that at the end of the podcast: You can be “right” all day long and still lose. How? You may have to litigate to prove your rightness - and that might cost more than it is worth to prove.

450X_FTW > RevengencerAlf 08/02/2016 at 13:20

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Yep, it was several years ago I remember reading about it, because I wanted to lift my Jeep at the time and was reading into warranty issues

RevengencerAlf > 450X_FTW 08/02/2016 at 13:28

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I imagine that’s one that you should theoretically win. Making the engine “work” harder is a shit excuse for it breaking, especially in a vehicle rated for towing and offroad use. I would understand it with some further drivetrain components because it actually changes the radius for torque purposes, but as far as the engine is concerned, its own relationship with the gearbox hasn’t changed.

To echo the closing notes of Steve’s podcast, I’m guessing they just banked on the fact that nobody would want to deal with the expense of litigating that one.

RevengencerAlf > SteveLehto 08/02/2016 at 13:31

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Yep, but how often does it even go that far? For every person who you ask “are you willing to fight this” how many people just take the dealership on its word and don’t even consider that it’s an option. I imagine that’s what they bank on most, just that deterrent effect of “we put it in writing (sort of) so it must be true.”